[Sundaycommunity] To stop Russian manipulation, Francis must make Vatican's stand on Ukraine clear | National Catholic Reporter

Wed May 18 20:55:24 PDT 2022

Roberto, I agree with you.  We need to have FACTS to judge the war.  THE two world wars are 70+ and 100+ years ago and we still do not know ALL of the reasons for the ways and means that have happened in them.  German's are GOOD people, so are WE - it was just the leadership and HOW it was used that made the difference in the wars.  Thank God we had Churchill, and all of the Canadian people (INCLUDING my Mother, my FATHER, my uncles and aunts, my GRANDPARENTS - one can add it all of our own people) who made it hard for GERMANY to have a sway.
You are a good man, Roberto as is your wife Maryanne.  Thank you,
Mary Lou
Keeper of the Flame 

    On Wednesday, May 18, 2022, 07:57:48 p.m. EDT, Roberto via Sundaycommunity <sundaycommunity at lists.integralshift.ca> wrote:  

 Whose truth would send you free? Step carefully since believing is one thing, taking action another and all of us do it mostly with a inside felling that can always be wrong. Let me put it simpler, we really not even know the truth behind previous WW, 70 years later for one and more than 100 for the other, and you "believe" you know the issues of the Ukrainian war that is no even 3 months olds. Good for you. And I most agree with you, that not all the facts are published and we have been played in order to not complain about the effects we all are passing because of this War.But then,  main stream media has to fulfill a minimum of standards that many others cannot  and will ignore, furthermore it would be utterly impossible that all of them of so many countries and languages mostly agree in what is happening when they have witnesses in different parts of the war in Ukraine and surroundings. You do not have to believed any of them. However, they are good references at most since there are no other means that have a minimum of standards. Denying the value of references would leave you with publications based on someone's opinion and "their" interpretation of history. Very dangerous prospect, if you ask me.
Let me quote you again what I wrote you yesterday to close:
Most definitely, one should not trust everything one reads, but most of all never put faith in it.Also, it is clear to me, that whoever writes for others, it is giving it point of view on a given happening, in a very specific time, and with the information or facts available to the writer at the time. Most of them are not even witnesses of what they are writing, and they have to trust other for the accounts they are relating. In addition, there are prejudices that we all have, some that are evident to the writer and others that are not. Furthermore, all writers have to conform to standards of the medium the write and to the audiences the are writing to.And if you are not aware of all this variables and others, (like political and economical influences and needs, to mention just to gigantic distortions) I did not mention, you better not read anything, because your opinion, your knowledge and your being would live in a dream or nightmare of others.I can see you are in your own black hole of “information”, “facts that darken reality” but no one has the truth of just now less of other places and times. Do not blame the messenger or the means, just be aware of the weakness of our own communication and try NOT to convince others that what you are reading is better of what others are reading. Both have the same probability of being wrong.Huugs, Roberto

On May 14, 2022, at 15:05, Arthur Blomme via Sundaycommunity d for <sundaycommunity at lists.integralshift.ca> wrote:

Hi Bill 

The first casualty of war is the truth.
 <news.jpeg>  
The thing about war  is that you have to have the consent of the population to engage in war.  According to Noam Chomski the role of the media is to manufacture consent for  war.  When you just repeat back the narrative of the oligarchy controlled media who want regime change in Russia you are providing consent for the war.  When Canadians virtue signal their concern for Ukrainian refugees they are giving their consent to Canada sending  50 howitzers to the Ukraine. 

  The Wall Street Journal is even arguing for nuclear war. 
  That is what mainstream life is about.  Ignore history and don't question.  Fear Covid; hate the truckers and love Ukraine. I don't buy any of it.  
I am against war and  oppose Canada's arms trade.  I am for a sustainable life on our planet for all.

  The truth will set us free. 
  Art

  On 5/13/22 8:48 a.m., Bill Wright wrote:

  Wow.  You are really sour on mainstream life everywhere, Art.  Re Ukraine, I suggest you speak to some Ukrainians re who is pushing for Ukrainian independence and help from the West for military assistance.  Canada has about 1.5M people from the Ukraine.  You might say Canada is Ukrainian. 
  The Ukrainian strength is a grass roots strength.  It is all due to local Ukrainian willpower and motivation.  You are speaking for Russia, Art, when you say it is not Ukrainian will but it is Canada and the US actions.  Russia is proving to be a butcher and thief. 
  I think.  Thks. 
  Bill. 
     William Wright
 Partner
 Uncharted Software Inc.
 c 416-708-6677
 w 416-203-3003 x227

  On Fri, May 13, 2022 at 11:35 AM Art Blomme via Sundaycommunity <sundaycommunity at lists.integralshift.ca> wrote:

  Hi John I Hope you are well.   
  This NCR article appears to be the RC version of the Daily Beast article I sent out last week. 
  Maybe Francis realizes as do I that  Ukraine's war is a product of US and Canada aggression.  Canada has been providing military aid and selling armaments to the Ukraine ever since the US and Canadian backed coup in 2014.   
  My guess is that NCR is just another Imperial controled media outlet that is pushing the dominant narative manufacturing consent for regime change in Russia. 
  It gives me hope that the Pope can see through the fog of war propaganda. 
  The truth will set us free. 
  Art 

 On May 11, 2022 2:30 p.m., John Huot <jdhuot at gmail.com> wrote:

 To stop Russian manipulation, Francis must make Vatican's stand on Ukraine clear | National Catholic Reporter

 Hi everyone, This strikes me as an important, but sympathetic, , critique of Pope Francis’ public statements & symbolic gestures about the war in Ukraine. The main point of the article  is that Francis’ statements have been open to manipulation by Russia & the Russian Orthodox church, thereby creating confusion in Ukraine & elsewhere about Francis’ intent to condemn the Russian war of aggression, while advocating for an end to the war through negotiation & humanitarian actions by Russia to end civilian deaths, allow civilians to safely exit, cease fires etc.  John

 https://www.ncronline.org/news/opinion/stop-russian-manipulation-francis-must-make-vaticans-stand-ukraine-clear?utm_source=PANTHEON_STRIPPED&utm_campaign=PANTHEON_STRIPPED&utm_medium=PANTHEON_STRIPPED&utm_term=PANTHEON_STRIPPED
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